Piano Society
Free Classical Keyboard Recordings
It is currently Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:20 am

All times are UTC - 1 hour




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 24 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:58 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
Here, after maybe 100 takes over 3 days, is another prelude, not even one minute long. I am still not really satisfied with the groans that come from the piano, but I give up. Trying to get this piano to be delicate is like expecting a rhinoceros to perform the Dance of the Sugar-Plum Cherry.

To prove it is not I who is no good, I tried playing Bortkiewicz's Butterfly, which at home was almost impossible, on a Steinway 1/4 grand. Wonderful! I had no problem whatsoever in making the melody soar and keeping the right hand discrete, even if I hasd not tested the piano beforehand


Ismagilov - 24 Preludes No. 5 in D major

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Last edited by richard66 on Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:11 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 6:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:36 pm
Posts: 302
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
You've sent the wrong file, this is another copy of No 15.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 6:51 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:36 pm
Posts: 302
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
Oh, and another thing. The Kyoushinsha collection on youtube only has 15 of the 24, and No 5 isn't one of them. Do you have a secret source of the scores?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:57 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
true, sorry!

Yes. I have a SECRET source! Shhh! 8)

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:08 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 11:45 pm
Posts: 383
Location: New Jersey, USA
Richard,
I like this one <i>much</i> more than #15. Kind of reminiscent of Debussy's "Pagodes", and not just because of the pentatonics, either. You display a lot of discipline on this recording.
Not only do I like your playing, there's something about the piece that suits your recording setup better. Or have you changed your physical setup? Mike angle? Just curious, since I know nothing about recording.

_________________
stu kautsch


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:16 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
Thank you, stu. For me this one remembers the pealing of bells, the way they ring them in Orthodox countries. Even though I believe the composer to be Muslim (Bashkotistan is predominantly Muslim, as all Turkic lands are, with the exception of Yakutia), he must have heard church bells in Moscow. Speaking of church bells, I have seen in Russia people play bells as if they were a "keyboard" (for lack of a better word) A number of them are hung up in the same manner as tubular bells are, cords are attached to each of the hammers and joined together in a knot. The performer then holds the chords by the knot and, by moving the knot from right to left and at the same time twisting it, plays a melody.

I moved my recorder further away from the piano and placed it on cushions (I have a portable mp3 recorder) so that it faces the back of the piano. As the room is big and with relatively high ceilings, there is a natural reverbation that before was not present.

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:13 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:36 pm
Posts: 302
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
richard66 wrote:
For me this one remembers the pealing of bells
That's exactly my reaction too. Rather nice.
Quote:
I have seen in Russia people play bells as if they were a "keyboard" (for lack of a better word) A number of them are hung up in the same manner as tubular bells are, cords are attached to each of the hammers and joined together in a knot. The performer then holds the chords by the knot and, by moving the knot from right to left and at the same time twisting it, plays a melody.
Interesting. From your description this appears to resemble a primitive form of carillion, which really does have a keyboard. Except that the "keys" are more robust than those of an organ or piano and are more like large levers sticking out of a huge panel. They require more force, and travel through a larger distance, than the keys of a piano or organ, and are therefore not really playable with your fingers, you use your fists instead.

Since the score is "secret" I can't comment on any misreadings, but the piece doesn't sound as though it conceals any rhythmic pitfalls. (No. 2 looks worth trying!).

A small technical point not related to playing: You seen to have developed a system whereby you enter the composer's name once and it magically appears in three places at once, namely the MP3 file name, and the composer and title ID3 tags. On this occasion you've mis-spelled the composer's name (by transposing the 'l' and 'g') which has therefore affected all three places.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:05 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 11:45 pm
Posts: 383
Location: New Jersey, USA
Whoa! You can't get anything past rainer!
It looked a little funny but I thought it was just my dyslexia kicking in again.

_________________
stu kautsch


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 8:50 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
rainer wrote:
richard66 wrote:
For me this one remembers the pealing of bells
That's exactly my reaction too. Rather nice.
Quote:
I have seen in Russia people play bells as if they were a "keyboard" (for lack of a better word) A number of them are hung up in the same manner as tubular bells are, cords are attached to each of the hammers and joined together in a knot. The performer then holds the chords by the knot and, by moving the knot from right to left and at the same time twisting it, plays a melody.
Interesting. From your description this appears to resemble a primitive form of carillion, which really does have a keyboard. Except that the "keys" are more robust than those of an organ or piano and are more like large levers sticking out of a huge panel. They require more force, and travel through a larger distance, than the keys of a piano or organ, and are therefore not really playable with your fingers, you use your fists instead.

Since the score is "secret" I can't comment on any misreadings, but the piece doesn't sound as though it conceals any rhythmic pitfalls. (No. 2 looks worth trying!).

A small technical point not related to playing: You seen to have developed a system whereby you enter the composer's name once and it magically appears in three places at once, namely the MP3 file name, and the composer and title ID3 tags. On this occasion you've mis-spelled the composer's name (by transposing the 'l' and 'g') which has therefore affected all three places.

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 9:05 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
No misreadings, that I can guarantee, but there is a left hand e (over a d/a interval on the bass - all played together, thew e with the thumb) that steafastly refuses to show up on the recording, no matter how hard I hit it.

There is a Russian Surname Ismailov and for one of those reasons psychologists spend a career studying, I am apt to mix it up, so that IsmaGiLov becomes IsmaLiGov. Add to that that Ismail is used in Russia in its Arabic form (there is in Moskow a park called Ismailyj Park, that is Ishmael Park). Believe it or not, I mispelled the name three times, not counting the files I mispelled and that I saved! Quite a feat that one!

The score is not secret: is is available, but one needs to know Russian to be able to download it (you need to register). I do not want to put the score on the site, because the composer has some scheme by which he is paid (not by the user but by an advertiser - a type of pay per click) everytime the score of the mp3 file is accessed and I do not want to deprive him of that income, principally since someone else is paying him in my place! :)

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 3:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 9:48 pm
Posts: 2003
Location: U.S.A.
Hi Richard,

I really liked this piece a lot. I don't have the score, but your playing was very convincing indeed. Despite the limitations of the piano, you drew a beautiful tone from it. The new mic placement also seems beneficial. The sound of bells was also my first impression. It brought to mind the start of Ravel's "La Vallee des Cloches".

David

_________________
"Interpreting music means exploring the promise of the potential of possibilities." David April


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 9:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
Thank you, David!

Yes, I liked the piece the moment I played through it the fisrt time. After havng played it I listened to a recording. The piano is better, of course, besides some other things.

I have not yet changed tags or file name. If accepted I will submit a new, corrected, file, which is just waiting for the eventual green light.

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 9:27 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8529
Richard, can you please put up the corrected file today (or tonight still in your case)?
I know I will have a quiet day at work tomorrow and this will give me a little something to do.

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
There it is, Monica!

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:51 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8529
Ok, I've processed the file and will put it on the main site tomorrow. Sounded nice!

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 7:23 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
It seems to be up and working. Funny thing: both preludes Nos. 5 and 15 (note the "5") are in "simliar" keys (D major and D flat major), last the same time (1'04") and are the same size (1,5 Mb). Add to that that when I submitted No. 5 the first time I actually sent no 15 again by mistake! How far can coincidences go!

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 1:18 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:36 pm
Posts: 302
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
richard66 wrote:
Funny thing: both preludes Nos. 5 and 15 (note the "5") are in "simliar" keys (D major and D flat major), last the same time (1'04") and are the same size (1,5 Mb). Add to that that when I submitted No. 5 the first time I actually sent no 15 again by mistake! How far can coincidences go!
Well, it may be coincidence that two of your recordings last the same time (although your previous recording of No 15 lasted longer), but file size will of necessity be strongly correlated to duration, so that doesn't count as part of the "coincidence".

As for the prelude numbers 5 and 15 (which both end in the digit 5) "happening" to correspond to keys which are both major and both have D in their name (5 as natural and 15 as flat), this isn't really coincidence either, it is a consequence of a simple mathematical fact combined with the way Ismagilov has arranged his prelude numbering in relation to their keys.

Like in Bach's WTC, Ismagilov's 24 preludes consist of one in each key. No 1 is in C major, No 2 in C minor, No 3 in G major, etc. All the odd numbers are major and all the even numbers are minor (same as in WTC). But the way Ismagilov arranges his odd (major) numbers through the keys differs from WTC: Bach's numbers 1,3,5,7,etc correspond to C, C#, D,Eb,etc, ascending chromatically, whereas Ismagilov's ascend in "circle of fifths" order of, i.e. his 1,3,5,7,9,11,13 correspond to C,G,D,A,E,B,F# (I'm not sure about 13, it might be Gb instead of F#), and then they continue with 15,17,19,21,23 corresponding to Db,Ab,Eb,Bb,F.

Therefore you will find that not only do the D and Db preludes have numbers 5 and 15, but also that
A and Ab have 7 and 17,
E and Eb have 9 and 19,
B and Bb have 11 and 21, and finally either
F# and F have 13 and 23, or else
G and Gb have 3 and 13.

And why is this? It's because any two keys that are a semitone apart (like D and Db) are 7 steps apart in the circle of fifths and so their number of sharps differs by 7 (from D with 2 sharps to get to Db we must subtract 7 sharps to end up with -5 sharps which is the same as 5 flats), and since the prelude numbering goes up or down in steps of two (to skip the minor keys), it means we have to subtract 7 twice (or subtract 14) from the prelude number (so with the D major prelude being number 5, the Db major prelude must be number 5-14 or number -9), and then if necessary we need to add 24 to get it into the range 1 to 24. In short, we either subtract 14 or add 10, whichever gets us a result in the range 1 to 24. And of course when you add 10 to any number, its least significant digit does not change. :idea:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 4:12 am 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:38 pm
Posts: 8529
rainer wrote:
Well, it may be coincidence that two of your recordings last the same time (although your previous recording of No 15 lasted longer), but file size will of necessity be strongly correlated to duration, so that doesn't count as part of the "coincidence".

As for the prelude numbers 5 and 15 (which both end in the digit 5) "happening" to correspond to keys which are both major and both have D in their name (5 as natural and 15 as flat), this isn't really coincidence either, it is a consequence of a simple mathematical fact combined with the way Ismagilov has arranged his prelude numbering in relation to their keys.

Like in Bach's WTC, Ismagilov's 24 preludes consist of one in each key. No 1 is in C major, No 2 in C minor, No 3 in G major, etc. All the odd numbers are major and all the even numbers are minor (same as in WTC). But the way Ismagilov arranges his odd (major) numbers through the keys differs from WTC: Bach's numbers 1,3,5,7,etc correspond to C, C#, D,Eb,etc, ascending chromatically, whereas Ismagilov's ascend in "circle of fifths" order of, i.e. his 1,3,5,7,9,11,13 correspond to C,G,D,A,E,B,F# (I'm not sure about 13, it might be Gb instead of F#), and then they continue with 15,17,19,21,23 corresponding to Db,Ab,Eb,Bb,F.

Therefore you will find that not only do the D and Db preludes have numbers 5 and 15, but also that
A and Ab have 7 and 17,
E and Eb have 9 and 19,
B and Bb have 11 and 21, and finally either
F# and F have 13 and 23, or else
G and Gb have 3 and 13.

And why is this? It's because any two keys that are a semitone apart (like D and Db) are 7 steps apart in the circle of fifths and so their number of sharps differs by 7 (from D with 2 sharps to get to Db we must subtract 7 sharps to end up with -5 sharps which is the same as 5 flats), and since the prelude numbering goes up or down in steps of two (to skip the minor keys), it means we have to subtract 7 twice (or subtract 14) from the prelude number (so with the D major prelude being number 5, the Db major prelude must be number 5-14 or number -9), and then if necessary we need to add 24 to get it into the range 1 to 24. In short, we either subtract 14 or add 10, whichever gets us a result in the range 1 to 24. And of course when you add 10 to any number, its least significant digit does not change. :idea:


Yeah - what he said! :P ( I was going to say the same thing.... :lol: )

_________________
"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano
my personal website: http://www.monicaalianello.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 12:25 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
pianolady wrote:
rainer wrote:
Well, it may be coincidence that two of your recordings last the same time (although your previous recording of No 15 lasted longer), but file size will of necessity be strongly correlated to duration, so that doesn't count as part of the "coincidence".

As for the prelude numbers 5 and 15 (which both end in the digit 5) "happening" to correspond to keys which are both major and both have D in their name (5 as natural and 15 as flat), this isn't really coincidence either, it is a consequence of a simple mathematical fact combined with the way Ismagilov has arranged his prelude numbering in relation to their keys.

Like in Bach's WTC, Ismagilov's 24 preludes consist of one in each key. No 1 is in C major, No 2 in C minor, No 3 in G major, etc. All the odd numbers are major and all the even numbers are minor (same as in WTC). But the way Ismagilov arranges his odd (major) numbers through the keys differs from WTC: Bach's numbers 1,3,5,7,etc correspond to C, C#, D,Eb,etc, ascending chromatically, whereas Ismagilov's ascend in "circle of fifths" order of, i.e. his 1,3,5,7,9,11,13 correspond to C,G,D,A,E,B,F# (I'm not sure about 13, it might be Gb instead of F#), and then they continue with 15,17,19,21,23 corresponding to Db,Ab,Eb,Bb,F.

Therefore you will find that not only do the D and Db preludes have numbers 5 and 15, but also that
A and Ab have 7 and 17,
E and Eb have 9 and 19,
B and Bb have 11 and 21, and finally either
F# and F have 13 and 23, or else
G and Gb have 3 and 13.

And why is this? It's because any two keys that are a semitone apart (like D and Db) are 7 steps apart in the circle of fifths and so their number of sharps differs by 7 (from D with 2 sharps to get to Db we must subtract 7 sharps to end up with -5 sharps which is the same as 5 flats), and since the prelude numbering goes up or down in steps of two (to skip the minor keys), it means we have to subtract 7 twice (or subtract 14) from the prelude number (so with the D major prelude being number 5, the Db major prelude must be number 5-14 or number -9), and then if necessary we need to add 24 to get it into the range 1 to 24. In short, we either subtract 14 or add 10, whichever gets us a result in the range 1 to 24. And of course when you add 10 to any number, its least significant digit does not change. :idea:


Yeah - what he said! :P ( I was going to say the same thing.... :lol: )


Ah, very well, but the real coincidence is that I recorded and posted Nos 15 and 5 in sequence. Since the score is in Roman nuimbers, I was maybe not even aware the latter was No 5 until I actually had to name the file! :?

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 7:51 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:36 pm
Posts: 302
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
richard66 wrote:
Since the score is in Roman numbers, I was maybe not even aware the latter was No 5 until I actually had to name the file! :?
The fact that the Roman numbers both end in V should have set your "coincidence alarm" bells ringing. Isn't it a coincidence that No 5 sounds like bells? 8)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 8:56 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
rainer wrote:
richard66 wrote:
Since the score is in Roman numbers, I was maybe not even aware the latter was No 5 until I actually had to name the file! :?
The fact that the Roman numbers both end in V should have set your "coincidence alarm" bells ringing. Isn't it a coincidence that No 5 sounds like bells? 8)


:P

Let me check No. XXV... That is, 25!

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 9:32 pm 
Offline
Site Admin

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 11:45 am
Posts: 9598
Location: Netherlands
It's indeed a more appealing piece than the previous two. It makes me wonder though if Ismagilov can do more than short pieces where one idea is presented and being turned over once or twice.

_________________
Nothing is always absolutely so -- Sturgeon's law
Chris Breemer


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 12:53 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:18 pm
Posts: 1040
I agree with you there, Chris: of the three, it is the better one. He is not yet 30, or, if he is, he has only turned that age. He has time, though some people are finished by that age, some only start 20 years later. Think of Janacek. If I were playing pieces of his written in his 20s and you were commenting on them, you probably would have said the same. He has written a cello concerto, which you can find on YouTube.

You mentioned Lera Auerbach. I signed up for her site and have listened to some things of hers. The preludes seem technically demanding, but then she is the better pianist, though not particularly bleak, as you say. I find that her works in the major are just as dramatic as the ones in the minor and I detect in her the influence of Bach, even if she uses clusters.

I also tried her ballet The Little Mermaid. What utter nonsense these modern stage directors and choreographers think uo! You take a fairy-tale and turn it into an autobiography unfit for the main public of the story.

How Russian is she, thouigh, after all this time in the States?

_________________
Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Ismagilov prelude No 5
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:00 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 6:29 pm
Posts: 161
Location: Brazil
hi, Richard!

nice music!

_________________
Luís Sarro


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 24 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot] and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group