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 Post subject: Another dig
PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 7:08 pm 
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Here I go again...

Grieg - Lyric piece Op. 12, No. 1 - Arietta (1:22)

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Richard Willmer
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Last edited by richard66 on Fri Jul 27, 2012 8:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:12 pm 
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Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
The problem has been one of note durations, as I recall, in a number of specific places.

As far as bars 12 and 22 are concerned, you have this pretty well conquered now: the 2nd chords in both of them occur at pretty well the correct time, i.e. the F#-A lasts the right amount of time before you play the G-Bb. You are stretching the duration of those second chords to make time to fit in the Eb-G grace notes that lead to the next bar, and that's OK provided you know you're doing it, in other words provided you are aware that you exercising artistic control, and that although this makes the beginning of bars 13 and 23 technically late, you have decided you would rather do this than make the grace notes sound rushed.

The only real remaining problem now lies with bars 10 and 20. You are not giving yourself time to let the music contained in them say all it wants to, and seem anxious to get to the next bar.
The first chords of both bars last the right amount of time, so that the second chords occur at the right time, but you cut these second chords short [by about 25% in bar 10 and 50% in bar 20], so that the beginnings of the next bars come too early [bar 11 by about one 16th note and bar 21 by about two].


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:56 pm 
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Location: Carbondale, IL
Hi Richard,

I had a listen to your Grieg recording. I have heard it before in my piano studio class, my friend Hunter played it. My teacher said there was a directive on it that said to play it softly. I like your phrasing and your pedal usage instincts serve you here, but IMO you could use the soft pedal the first time, or on the repeat, to vary the dynamics of the refrain.

Sounds good,

Riley

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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 8:41 am 
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rainer wrote:
The problem has been one of note durations, as I recall, in a number of specific places.

As far as bars 12 and 22 are concerned, you have this pretty well conquered now: the 2nd chords in both of them occur at pretty well the correct time, i.e. the F#-A lasts the right amount of time before you play the G-Bb. You are stretching the duration of those second chords to make time to fit in the Eb-G grace notes that lead to the next bar, and that's OK provided you know you're doing it, in other words provided you are aware that you exercising artistic control, and that although this makes the beginning of bars 13 and 23 technically late, you have decided you would rather do this than make the grace notes sound rushed.

The only real remaining problem now lies with bars 10 and 20. You are not giving yourself time to let the music contained in them say all it wants to, and seem anxious to get to the next bar.
The first chords of both bars last the right amount of time, so that the second chords occur at the right time, but you cut these second chords short [by about 25% in bar 10 and 50% in bar 20], so that the beginnings of the next bars come too early [bar 11 by about one 16th note and bar 21 by about two].


Getting close... About the appoggiature, I prefer them like that. I did play them fast at one point, but did not like it too much.

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Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:02 am 
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Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
richard66 wrote:
Getting close... About the appoggiature, I prefer them like that. I did play them fast at one point, but did not like it too much.
Fair enough.

I should have mentioned that the rest of it is pretty good too now, with a tempo that flows nicely without being too fast, and I also like that you have toned down the accents at the beginning and middle of each bar, which you previously overemphasized, making the piece sound almost like a military march.


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 12:19 pm 
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Thank you!

I relearnt the technique to "separate" the fingers, whih apparently I had forgotten, so that the 2nd and 4th note of the melody in bar 1, for example, is not affected by what the thumb and index fingers of the same hand are doing at the same time.

I have also redone the Schumann, but there is still something there that needs improvement. I probably will post it today. I really hope I can remove the one on the site, which is to me an embarassment. I tried to listen to it the other day but had to turn it off after 30 seconds.

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Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:26 pm 
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well.....It's all fine except for bars 10 and 20. I don't understand how the two bars with the most simplest rhythm can give you such a hard time. You are not giving enough time to the second quarter note and hence jumping into the next bar too soon. I feel that it disturbs the flow too much. I think I've told you this before, but just tap your foot when you are at this place....two taps and then don't go to the next bar until the foot is coming down again on the first beat of the next bar. I am going crazy? Isn't that the way the bars in question are to be played? Sorry, Richard....but it's not yet ready for the site, unless someone tells me that I'm the one who is wrong here.




richard66 wrote:

I have also redone the Schumann, but there is still something there that needs improvement. I probably will post it today. I really hope I can remove the one on the site, which is to me an embarassment. I tried to listen to it the other day but had to turn it off after 30 seconds.


We can take it down if you want right now. :?:

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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:37 pm 
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pianolady wrote:
well.....It's all fine except for bars 10 and 20. I don't understand how the two bars with the most simplest rhythm can give you such a hard time. You are not giving enough time to the second quarter note and hence jumping into the next bar too soon. I feel that it disturbs the flow too much. I think I've told you this before, but just tap your foot when you are at this place....two taps and then don't go to the next bar until the foot is coming down again on the first beat of the next bar. I am going crazy? Isn't that the way the bars in question are to be played? Sorry, Richard....but it's not yet ready for the site, unless someone tells me that I'm the one who is wrong here.


I wonder if this is not my former learning that is getting in the way or at least the learning how to play such passages in Mozart, where the resolution was supposet to be lighter and shorter. Obviously an equivalent rest is to be inserted and that might be missing. Does this make sense?


pianolady wrote:
richard66 wrote:

I have also redone the Schumann, but there is still something there that needs improvement. I probably will post it today. I really hope I can remove the one on the site, which is to me an embarassment. I tried to listen to it the other day but had to turn it off after 30 seconds.


We can take it down if you want right now. :?:


It might be a service to PS more than to me if you do.

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Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:09 am 
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Thinking that one of your earlier recordings sounds terrible is actually a good sign. It means you are improving! :)

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"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 8:31 pm 
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I have made another recording of the Arietta. I wonder if this is it. I placed in the fisrt post, removing the old one.

I am getting there with a new Schumann.

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Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 3:14 am 
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Location: Carbondale, IL
Richard,

I have replaced your latest recording with a link, this version sounds a lot more polished. Check to see that it plays ok.

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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 12:12 pm 
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Finally! Thank you!

All seems well, though the link does not appear neither on my page or on the Grieg one.

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Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 7:17 pm 
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It's on the main site (I actually put it there earlier this morning but forgot to say something here). Your rhythm is much better now :!: :)

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"Simplicity is the highest goal, achievable when you have overcome all difficulties." ~ Frederic Chopin

my videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/monicapiano


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 7:58 pm 
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pianolady wrote:
It's on the main site (I actually put it there earlier this morning but forgot to say something here). Your rhythm is much better now :!: :)


Indeed: all is there, thank you.

It must be the American in Paris which the little girl watches every day. "I got rhythm, I got music, I..." It seeps in after a while.

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Richard Willmer
"Please do not shoot the pianist
He is doing his best."
Oscar Wilde: Impressions of America: Leadville


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 Post subject: Re: Another dig
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:10 pm 
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This shows enormous improvement since your first attempt. It proves how good it is to persevere and not get dispirited by all the criticism. This at last sounds convincing and flowing. With more confidence would, I hope, come a bit more freedom - it's just a little bit straight (though certainly not rigid). The only little nag I can think of is that you could play the LH a bit softer to give the melody more room. That would make it a really good recording.
Good job !

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