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 Post subject: Arranging Gospel Music and Hymns
PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 9:51 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 6:50 pm
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Location: Missouri
I know this isn't an arranging forum, but I thought any of you hymn/gospel lovers might be able to give me some constructive criticism as I am interested in doing this kind of thing. Sorry if the audio is not too great, but I have not gone out and purchased anything better yet. I'm still shopping for something right now. I'd love to hear the good comments and I can take the bad- it'll only make it better. I think it might be one of my better audios- however.
Anyway
Thanks in advance!

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:04 pm 
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I don't think this is in my Methodist hymnal because I have never heard this one. You're right that the sound is better on this file than on some of your previous recordings. As to your arrangement, to be honest, I think you used too many arpeggios. The repetitiveness gets a little tiresome. Could be just the piece itself, though. There are times when I cannot find a melody. Also, there is a passage with descending thirds where I think you made a mistake. It's the seventh one which should be a C and A-flat. You played a C and A-natural (I think). Probably just a slip, I know you are just trying this out. The parts where I do hear a melody and you are not bothering with too many arpeggios or rolled chords, then it sounds good.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 5:14 pm 
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Location: Obamanation, unfortunately...
I never heard this in my church before, even if we have neo / liberal choir director and a "modernist" priest. (I cringe at some of the songs, one of which uses only one word "hallelujah" over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. With the clap on the first beat and the bongo drums in the background.....certainly the world is going to hell in a handbasket fast.) :roll: whatever happened to the Tridentine? :(

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:10 pm 
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Location: Missouri
pianolady:
Quote:
There are times when I cannot find a melody


I can understand where you would say that- Monica. I don't think I was totally in rhythm the whole time- and yes, the descending thirds did have some mistakes, I wasn't totally sure of the notes- should have worked on it more. As far as the arpeggios- you are probably right- I just didn't know what else to do to fill the part.
This song is part of the non-denominational Christian church's hymnal. By the way, did you enjoy the hymn, of what you could hear and understand?

juufa72 what type of church do you attend? I have never heard of the Tridentine before.

Would you accept recordings recorded like this in the future, then?

Thanks for the comments!


This is a video of Dino Kartsonakis playing at the composers funeral.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFuC3R87IA8[/url]

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 11:07 pm 
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I am not sure if we should start accepting improvisations on hymns. If we did, I think both the arrangement and the playing need to be much better than this. It sounds rather tentative and shaky, the rhythm uncertain and the melody line insufficiently standing out (partly because the accompaniment is much too loud).

A hymn setting should as a rule be kept straight and simple, not pimped up with lots of arpeggios, gestures, and ritardandi. In hymn singing, there needs to be a rock steady pulse, a crystal clear melody line, and a logical complement of alto, tenor and bass voices (or at least a steady ground bass that supports the whole from the bottom up).

I don't know this particular song, being more involved in traditional calvinist-protestant congregation singing. Actually I am just having some organ lessons specifically focused on accompanying, and I guess the things I am learning there can be applied here, too. Bottom line, keep it simple, steady, clear, and above all, singable.

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 Post subject: :)
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 11:24 pm 
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Location: Missouri
OK- thanks- well as far as accepting goes- I meant, in particular, the audio quality of the song- not necessarily songs like this. I guess I didn't make that clear.

I just adore the hymns that arranged very beautifully- and so maybe I have over done it, because I was trying to be like that. Keep in mind- this is something kind of new to me. :)

I always have had a hard time keeping the accompaniment soft. Though- I am tons better than I was. Still working on that.

Thanks for the constructive criticism and tips Chris! You're so lucky to be learning the organ.

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 Post subject: Re: :)
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 5:55 pm 
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fluterific00 wrote:
OK- thanks- well as far as accepting goes- I meant, in particular, the audio quality of the song- not necessarily songs like this. I guess I didn't make that clear.

Nope :D
The audio quality is not bad - not optimal but sufficient. Certainly better than in previous recordings. The piano has a nice, sturdy, homely sound, making it suitable for repertoire like this. Though maybe less so for concert repertoire. It seems a bit bass-heavy, or maybe that's your recording setup. You may want to try a bass cut or treble boost. It could also your RH just needs to be more assertive (are you left-handed ?)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 8:35 pm 
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Location: Obamanation, unfortunately...
fluterific00 wrote:
juufa72 what type of church do you attend? I have never heard of the Tridentine before.


St. James Catholic church. And the Tridentine mass was the common way before Vatican Council II rearranged the mass (i.e. no longer in Latin, the priest faces the people, etc.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tridentine_Mass

So our songs are new age melodies with lots of baptist influence....garbage to my ears.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:20 pm 
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Location: Missouri
Quote:
It could also your RH just needs to be more assertive (are you left-handed ?)


Actually- no. Does it tend to be that way? I think it is my recording set up. My piano is a
Kimball upright, we have looked into getting a better one at times, but our funds don't allow for one right now. Maybe in the future when I earn more students, though. Which I need to work harder at. :)
juufa72- That is interesting about your church. I am not much familiar with the Catholic church.

At least the audio was a bit better! I have improved some in that area. :) I may try some different
microphone set-ups we have around the house for future recordings. Hopefully, they'll get better.
I would use my keyboard, but I prefer the acoustic to that, and the keyboard doesn't have all of the keys. :) And, I can't use my church's piano, because it'd be even worse. :cry: If I was at my former church, I would have a better set-up as I am sure they would have allowed me to use it. Grand piano and all.

Anyway,

Thanks for the comments!

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