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PostPosted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 12:26 am 
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Pianolady wrote:
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Ok, chapter 3 was very short.


Yes, but it´s full of subtle observations and narrative details. It´s so fascinating how the narrator describes the arrival and first time with his new piano as a kind of process of meeting a new friend. So, he searches for the history and the provenance of this new piano and did several more or less absurd speculations about the letters L.A. At the end we come a bit nearer to the question, why the new clients of Luc have to be recommended by other clients. The chapter ends with Lucs advice, that the narrator is a client now and that he can recommend now also "trusted friends". So, I suppose, the reason for the recommendation-necessarity is, that Desforges piano shop does only want clients, who have a sincere and deep relation to pianos and not every people of the street have it.
Could I be right with this?

Quote:
And now the piano is at its new home. Isn't that nice? Remember when your new piano came to your home? I do - vividly. One of the most exciting days!


Yes, I have had four of such delivery-events in my life until now (apart from relocations, in which my grand also had to be transported into my new home).
When I was 10 we got an old Ibach-piano, with 13 I got a Seiler upright, with 15 my Kawai-GS60-grand-piano and with 35 I sold my Kawai and bought my Grotrian-Steinweg. The Grotrian had to be transported with a linkage over the balcony out of the house of the former owner, an old lady. Then it came with a truck to my house. Here the transport was quite easy, because my living-room is on ground-floor. So, there was only a little staircase with five steps, which is before the entry of our house.

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Sometime in the near future, we will be taking the carpeting out of our living room and replace it with hard wood. My piano will need to be moved out of the house while the construction is going on. I am not looking forward to that.


That really sounds disagreeable. :? Is it really necessary to move out your piano entirely out of the house, can´t you put it just in another room?

Tomorrow I´ll continue with chapter 4. :)

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 9:42 pm 
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musicusblau said:
[Quote]What do you mean with this? Which club?[Quote]

I'm sorry, i wasn't so clear. I was asking if you were the type that enjoyed smiling at people who aren't going to smile back. It is a very common expression for being an altruist. I was wondering whether or not you yourself are an altruist.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 10:38 pm 
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Lukecash wrote:
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I'm sorry, i wasn't so clear. I was asking if you were the type that enjoyed smiling at people who aren't going to smile back. It is a very common expression for being an altruist. I was wondering whether or not you yourself are an altruist.


Phew, that´s a very difficult and personal question. :oops: Probably, if I´d be in the right mood, I could enjoy to smile back to people, who aren´t going to smile back, but may be do the opposite. This is what you meant, isn´t it? (Oops, in this moment I feel to decrease rapidly my sureness in the English language :lol: ) I think, I can be altruistic sometimes or often, but not always. That´s probably the most honest answer I could give you on your question.
But now you have to allow me to return your question:
Do you feel yourself to be altruistic? And always? (I don´t believe, a man would say this of himself, isn´t it?)

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 2:06 pm 
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Oh! Andreas - I learned our character's name in chapter 6! I will not tell you here and let you find it yourself.

Chapters 4, 5 and 6 are very short. I read them last night. Have you read them yet? I don't want to give away everything.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 8:12 pm 
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I admire your intellect that you would make me feel like a bastard to call myself an altruist :twisted:
Let's say i do my damnedest. I plan on doing missionary work, refuse to use my skills very much in the educational system, enjoy very much a good natured debate to help people understand things that just don't necessarily give you an answer right away. I simply want people to feel fulfilled, more than just expendable, and wonderful, because in all reality they are. I don't always get the job done, but yes, i never stop wanting to.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 9:54 pm 
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Hi Lukecash,
I fear we go out of topic now, but I´d like to give you a last answer to the discussion you´ve begun at this place. I think, it should be the last one, because I think, we loose the relation to the book "The piano shop on the left bank", which is the subject of this thread.
Lukecash wrote:
Quote:
I admire your intellect that you would make me feel like a bastard to call myself an altruist :twisted:


Nothing of this was my intention or planned. I just told you honestly, what I think in general.

Quote:
Let's say i do my damnedest. I plan on doing missionary work, refuse to use my skills very much in the educational system, enjoy very much a good natured debate to help people understand things that just don't necessarily give you an answer right away.


We all seem to have more or less an "altruistic" site or aspect of our personality. F.ex. if we are members here on PS we share our recordings for free with many others and we try to help each other with our tips and comments. While doing all this we are all personalities with our own mind and ego. And we all try to help other people to become aware of things, which we consider for good ones and of which we are convinced. All this is very usual IMO.
But I´m very doubtfully to people, who think, they have the only "right answer" to things (especially to the "last things" like religion and God or similar issues) and who think, they have to convince other people in "missionary work".
So, to be really "altruistic" in the true sense of the word means for me not to consider the own personality and the own ego for the absolute truth. I think, the truth mirrors in our personalities in different ways, depending on our character and predisposition, but we never can say, that we have the absolute truth for ourself. That´s impossible! Plato´s Parable of the Cave is a good philosophic allegory to show this f.ex. And in Goethes "Faust" we found this idea in Fausts words: "In the coloured reflection we have the life." (=My personal translation of: "Am farbigen Abglanz haben wir das Leben.")
I feel very fulfilled with music and other things. So, I personally really don´t need any missionary. Thank you for this discussion, anyway.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 10:15 pm 
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Oh! Andreas - I learned our character's name in chapter 6! I will not tell you here and let you find it yourself.


Thank you, Monica, that will keep my curiosity.

Quote:
Chapters 4, 5 and 6 are very short. I read them last night. Have you read them yet? I don't want to give away everything.


I´m just at the end of chapter four. I think, I´ll read until chaper 6 (including chapter 6) this night. I´m going on with to read now. I think, I´ll need two hours or so (I do not read so fastly like you, I suppose, because I´m not a native speaker. :wink: ) I´m up to read on and have a big interest. I´m really glad, you read with me. So, tomorrow I´ll write something to chapter 4-6, I think.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 1:15 am 
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O.k., I have read chapters 4-6:
In "Madame Gaillard" we meet the first piano-teacher of Thad Carhart (in ch. 6 we experience, that the first-person-narrator is the author himself), when he was five. He gets first an own upright, which his parents buy at an auction. But this first upright breaks down after its first hard use in the familiy and Thad may practise at the neighbours house.
Madame Gaillard is described as a kind and encouraging teacher of an "infinitive patience".
It´s wonderful to have such a teacher, especially for the beginning, isn´t it?

In chapter 5 (The one which fits) acts of Lucs opportunity to by an old Steinway, Model C, built in 1896, but unfortuenately his apartment is to small for this big grand-piano. So, he has to sell it and to restore a Pleyel-grand with 6 legs for himself, which is described to look like a harpsichord for Thad.

In chapter 6 Mrs. Pemberton is desribed not so likely as Madame Gaillard. Thad is back in the USA, in Virginia and is between 8 and 9 years old now. Mrs. Pemberton seems to love etudes of Hanon and other technical exercises. She emphasizes highly the annual recital of her pupils in her own house, which is cleaned shining and blank for this event of public presentation of her pupils, which by the author is considered as a social game with no deeper meaning. For himself it´s important to study music for itself in his own privateness. Here he has the feeling truely to come near to music, whereas the public recitals he feels to be like circus-performances.
All stays from them is a nightmare: he doesn´t know, how his piece begins and Mrs. Pemberton isn´t there.

I find to be interesting, that the playing in public is considered as a "special gift", which for the author seems not truely to have to do with music itself. Who has this gift, can make a musical career, who has is not, is not able to make this career. Thad himself has not this special talent to play in public, but he seems to be sensitive and musical nevertheless.
I think for similar reasons, Glenn Gould decided in the 50th not to play anymore in public, but only to make recordings. I personally can understand this decision up to a certain point, because playing in public means, that you have no time to revise something, and that´s inhuman in a way, on the other side I consider a public recital as a great chance of transmitting authenticly and lively messages of music, which can´t be done in a recording in the same way, because there isn´t the directness and immediacy.
What do you think of this issue, Monica?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:56 pm 
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What I liked about chapter 4 was the very last paragraph - specifically the lines, "The piano became a kind of flying carpet by which I could travel to an entirely different place, and I would leave the room with the half-dazed sensibility that children sometimes show when they have discovered a new and agreeable and utterly private world of their own."

I get that feeling still today sometimes.



musicusblau wrote:
In chapter 5 (The one which fits) acts of Lucs opportunity to by an old Steinway, Model C, built in 1896, but unfortuenately his apartment is to small for this big grand-piano


Yes, poor Luc. I felt bad that he could not have the piano of his dreams. Sounds like it was a beautiful piano, doesn’t it? He even considered knocking down a wall in his house so the piano would fit. I can relate to that.

Chapter 6 - Yes, I could almost feel the anxiety that Thad felt when he sat at the piano but could not remember how to start his piece. That’s an awful feeling! And that gave him those nightmares.


Quote:
What do you think of this issue, Monica?

I have several conflicting thoughts on this issue. I certainly do not have this ‘gift’ of playing well in public. Although I badly wish I did. Every single time I have played in public, I have not been happy with my performance. I have the piece down all right, but because of nerves it never goes well. When I sit down to play in a room full of people, I want so much for them to hear how wonderful the music is. But I make slips, or have memory gaps and the piece isn’t as good as it should have been. Very maddening. Then also is that I want the people to think that I am a good pianist, but of course that can’t be when I do these shoddy performances.

But…people in the audience are not like us – most of them, anyway. They are not as critical and discerning as we are. After my performances, I hear from people things like, ‘that was wonderful’, or ‘what great music’, or ‘you played perfectly’. In my mind I’m thinking, ‘are you nuts? That was a horrible performance.” But they don’t see it that way. So all of that makes me glad that I do have a chance to play for people sometimes.

But…also…since I am never happy with my performances because I feel I do not convey the music properly to an audience, then I think I am more like Gould and our character, Thad, in that I am better off playing only for myself. That’s when my music is the best. But then again…isn’t life better when you can share your joys with others?

Oh, Andreas – I’m getting very mixed up right now, probably because I do have to perform in a recital in three weeks. Only one piece, thank goodness, but I haven’t even chosen which piece I will play yet. It’s a choice between a Granados Spanish Dance, or a Mompou Cancion & Danza. I’m working up both of them this week, but it’s not going well and now I’m getting upset. Sorry for all of this – I just had to let out some of my own anxieties.

I'll get on with the next chapter later today. And don't feel like you need to hurry and read. We have all the time in the world.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:50 pm 
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Pianolady wrote:
Quote:
I have several conflicting thoughts on this issue. I certainly do not have this ‘gift’ of playing well in public. Although I badly wish I did. Every single time I have played in public, I have not been happy with my performance. I have the piece down all right, but because of nerves it never goes well. When I sit down to play in a room full of people, I want so much for them to hear how wonderful the music is. But I make slips, or have memory gaps and the piece isn’t as good as it should have been. Very maddening. Then also is that I want the people to think that I am a good pianist, but of course that can’t be when I do these shoddy performances.


I know all this very well, Monica. I have played very often in public in my life and this summer I´ll have little recital again. I´ll play the Scherzo no.3 and several Nocturnes, prelude by Chopin and I think, some Songs without Words by Mendelssohn.
I think, our main-problem is our ego with all its excitement and stage-fright. I very often have made the experience, if I try to forget myself and to concentrate on music itself, it becomes much better and the music begins to flow through me somehow. If I get this feeling, I´m totally happy and satisfied. The only problem is, that I´m not always in the right mood, if I do play in public and I´m not able to forget myself always, when I do play in public. So, it´s a new game every time I do it, sometimes it´s more or less successfull, sometimes not.

Quote:
But…people in the audience are not like us – most of them, anyway. They are not as critical and discerning as we are. After my performances, I hear from people things like, ‘that was wonderful’, or ‘what great music’, or ‘you played perfectly’. In my mind I’m thinking, ‘are you nuts? That was a horrible performance.” But they don’t see it that way. So all of that makes me glad that I do have a chance to play for people sometimes.


O.k., you are right and I know this too well, too, but this never makes me truely happy, if I´m honest. I have to be satisfied with my playing myself and not with the praise of people, who don´t know anything about music or are probably only too polite to say honestly what they think about my bad performance.

Quote:
But…also…since I am never happy with my performances because I feel I do not convey the music properly to an audience, then I think I am more like Gould and our character, Thad, in that I am better off playing only for myself. That’s when my music is the best. But then again…isn’t life better when you can share your joys with others?


I have a clear opinion concerning this issue recording against live-performance: live-performances in public have the very higher value for me, because they are more lively, spontaneous and demanding than to make a recording! They demand, what music is originally made for: that the heart is edified by the music and for this the player has to breath totally the mind of the music itself, which he is performing. To "breath the mind of the music" means to lose oneself in this higher spirit for the moment of this live-performance. That´s indeed the gift a true musician should have. And I have to admit, that I also have to fight with it. But I´ll try it again and again and I never will give it up, because it´s the celestialest one can experience on earth, I think.

Quote:
Oh, Andreas – I’m getting very mixed up right now, probably because I do have to perform in a recital in three weeks. Only one piece, thank goodness, but I haven’t even chosen which piece I will play yet. It’s a choice between a Granados Spanish Dance, or a Mompou Cancion & Danza. I’m working up both of them this week, but it’s not going well and now I’m getting upset. Sorry for all of this – I just had to let out some of my own anxieties.


This is very understandable for me. I know these feelings too well. You are a real good pianist IMO and you´ll have success! Try to concentrate on music itself like I have described above. It´s the only medicine against the stage-fright. You have played so much pieces for PS, so that you´ll be successful with to play just one piece in public!

Quote:
I'll get on with the next chapter later today. And don't feel like you need to hurry and read. We have all the time in the world.


Yes, you are right. But I like this book and I´d like to use my Easter-vacations for myself to read as much as possible of it. So, I´ll read chapter 7, too, this evening. :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:59 am 
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Hi Monica,
in chapter 7 we meet a new character, Joss, a piano-tuner, who is originated in Germany.
In chapter 8 we experience "how it (=a piano) works", we read a lot about the main-features of a piano and here I have learned some interesting new English words like "soundboard" (I think in german it´s "Resonanzkörper") and "pin-block" (= "Stimmstock"). But it´s not only enlightening concerning the building of a piano, we look also at the relationship between him and Luc at the end of the chapter: for Thad pianos are a nice avocation of his responsibilities and for Luc they are a profession, a true craft, in which the craftsman is deeply connected with his item and with his customers. And Thad learns, that the process of approximation to Luc is much slower than it would be to a friend in America, because he seems more closed. But they tacitly understand each other and that´s the main-thing. For Luc Thads private interest is like an affirmation of his profession.

Today I´ll read chapter 9 (and may be 10). You are right, Monica, we have all the time of the world, and, please, feel free to read in your own tempo. If I consider, that the book has 24 chapters, I think, I´ll not get through it during my vacation, which end on sunday. Of course, I´ll continue to read also after my vacation, but I´ll have fewer time for such things, when I have to work again.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:02 pm 
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Hi Andreas,

Quote:
But I´ll try it again and again and I never will give it up, because it´s the celestialest one can experience on earth, I think.

Wow – that’s very profound. I think I would be in a state of shock if I ever performed in front of an audience and played perfectly. Maybe that is also like having a celestial experience. But I think I also get that from just playing alone in my living room when I am able to let a piece roll right off my fingers without any trouble.

Quote:
This is very understandable for me. I know these feelings too well. You are a real good pianist IMO and you´ll have success! Try to concentrate on music itself like I have described above. It´s the only medicine against the stage-fright. You have played so much pieces for PS, so that you´ll be successful with to play just one piece in public!

Thanks for the pep talk. I will probably need another one soon!

Chapter 7 - You are close, but Jos is actually Dutch.

Chapter 8 - I have recently done some research on how pianos are built, so I know all about the parts of the pianos Thad was describing.

Have you ever seen a piano totally dismantled? I have not. But whenever I see photos of one, I feel a little sick – almost like I am looking at the insides of a creature.

And I don’t why, but reading about dismantling a piano made me think of my brother. My dad has an old Whizzer built in the 1930’s. It is a kind of motor bike. He still rides it. Anyway, without my dad knowing, when my brother was young he one day decided that he was going to paint the Whizzer red. (it was black before). So he took it all apart and painted it, but when he put it back together, he didn’t do it right, as there were still some parts lying around. We laugh now, but my dad was not happy about it then.

Chapter 9 - fall boards. Interesting how our character gets a lot of geography lessons as he comes upon different pianos. Throughout his life, Thad has not been able to resist walking up to a piano he finds in a hotel lobby or restaurant and lift the fall board so he can see who made the piano and then he also pushes down on some keys - usually getting reprimanded by a clerk or manager who shoos Thad away from the piano. My favorite line in this chapter is when he says, "It was my own personal form of anarchism, and I was nothing if not persistent."

Ok - I'll try to get to chapter 10 later today.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:54 pm 
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Quote:
I think I would be in a state of shock if I ever performed in front of an audience and played perfectly. Maybe that is also like having a celestial experience.


That´s funny! :lol:

Quote:
But I think I also get that from just playing alone in my living room when I am able to let a piece roll right off my fingers without any trouble.


Yes, me too, but in a live-performance before other people the "thrill" is much bigger. But I agree also to Thad words of chapter 9: "No recitals, no grinning adults and special requests. Just me and the unexceptional playing that swelled into intricate fantasies of triumphe and transcendence."
Of course, you can have that good feeling also while playing at home and/or making recordings.

Quote:
Thanks for the pep talk. I will probably need another one soon!


O.k., I´ll be here. :wink:

Quote:
Chapter 7 - You are close, but Jos is actually Dutch.


:oops: I don´t really know, why I thought he is german, may be because he said a sentence with "ja" at the end. :lol:

Quote:
Chapter 8 - I have recently done some research on how pianos are built, so I know all about the parts of the pianos Thad was describing.


Wow, that´s profound work.

Quote:
Have you ever seen a piano totally dismantled? I have not. But whenever I see photos of one, I feel a little sick – almost like I am looking at the insides of a creature.


Yes, especially if it is the own piano, I think. :?

Quote:
And I don’t why, but reading about dismantling a piano made me think of my brother. My dad has an old Whizzer built in the 1930’s. It is a kind of motor bike. He still rides it. Anyway, without my dad knowing, when my brother was young he one day decided that he was going to paint the Whizzer red. (it was black before). So he took it all apart and painted it, but when he put it back together, he didn’t do it right, as there were still some parts lying around. We laugh now, but my dad was not happy about it then.


Yes, it´s better to dismantle something only, if you are able to assemble it completly again, later. But I know this experience, because I have made it several times myself. :lol:

Quote:
Chapter 9 - fall boards. Interesting how our character gets a lot of geography lessons as he comes upon different pianos. Throughout his life, Thad has not been able to resist walking up to a piano he finds in a hotel lobby or restaurant and lift the fall board so he can see who made the piano and then he also pushes down on some keys - usually getting reprimanded by a clerk or manager who shoos Thad away from the piano. My favorite line in this chapter is when he says, "It was my own personal form of anarchism, and I was nothing if not persistent."


Yes, that´s a good sentence, because it testifys to the individual will of Thad. I have started with chapter 9, hope to reach also the end of chapter 10 this night. Thank you, Monica.

BTW, have a look at my first picture-experiment with Adobe Photoshop in my guitar-thread, if you like. :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2009 2:12 pm 
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Ok, Andreas - I just read chapter 10. It's a little longer than the others. Here are my thoughts:

I enjoyed reading about the development of the piano from harpsichord to what it is today. And isn’t it interesting how piano music developed along with it? Of course that goes without saying, really, except in Beethoven’s case who wrote music for a piano which didn’t quite exist yet. Mozart and Haydn also benefited the most at the time as when the pianos dynamic capabilities evolved, although I find it funny that Beethoven seemed to wreck every piano he played.

I didn’t know that it was Erard who invented the double escapement action. What would we do without that? And thanks to the American for inventing the one-piece cast-iron frame which allows our Romantic music to be played with abandon. This is just what Liszt needed! Prior to the cast-iron frame, the pianos which he played upon would mostly end up in pieces on the stage and therefore several pianos were sitting backstage at his concerts so that they could replace the one that he destroyed. Amazing! Sure would have been fun to be at one of his concerts!

Interesting, the reason behind why most grands (concert grands) are black today, but there really is no reason why the keys are black and white, except that they go better with the black or brown pianos.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2009 11:36 pm 
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PIanolady wrote:
Quote:
I enjoyed reading about the development of the piano from harpsichord to what it is today. And isn’t it interesting how piano music developed along with it? Of course that goes without saying, really, except in Beethoven’s case who wrote music for a piano which didn’t quite exist yet. Mozart and Haydn also benefited the most at the time as when the pianos dynamic capabilities evolved, although I find it funny that Beethoven seemed to wreck every piano he played.


Yes, at last he had a lovely piano built by Conrad Graf in Wien. I have a gramphon-recording on which Jörg Demus plays some Beethoven-pieces on it, also the 6 Bagatelles I remember. It has a complete different sound from modern pianos, the colour of the tones is much more unbalanced and somehow thiner than the one of modern pianos. I have seen this piano, when I visited the Beethoven-Haus in Bonn, where he was born and has lived. I would like to mention the quotation from the book: "In a sense Beethoven was composint for an instrument, which didn´t still exist. Within a generation it would, and the piano would reach it´s apotheosis." So, Beethoven was truely a visionary. I found to be interesting the comparison to what a man of the middelage must have been felt, when he saw Notre-Dame in Paris, that´s what must have felt a musician of the 19th century when sitting on Beethovens "Graf"-grand. So, what´s to be felt as "great" or "appealing" is all a question of habbit and development.

Quote:
I didn’t know that it was Erard who invented the double escapement action. What would we do without that?


I knew this. It´s really one of the most important point in piano-delevopment.

Quote:
And thanks to the American for inventing the one-piece cast-iron frame which allows our Romantic music to be played with abandon. This is just what Liszt needed! Prior to the cast-iron frame, the pianos which he played upon would mostly end up in pieces on the stage and therefore several pianos were sitting backstage at his concerts so that they could replace the one that he destroyed. Amazing! Sure would have been fun to be at one of his concerts!


I agree, it would have been great, to see how a piano went to the floor, when Liszt played it personally. :lol:

Quote:
Interesting, the reason behind why most grands (concert grands) are black today, but there really is no reason why the keys are black and white, except that they go better with the black or brown pianos.


I could imagine, there is a reson, why the keys are black and white. Since the keys were made of ivory until 1980, they are white of their nature and I suppose, the best colour to make them different from these white ivory-keys was black for the chromatic tones. That´s my personal explanation, what do you think?
My Grotrian-Steinweg is built in 1980 and it still has ivory-keys. Does your grand have ivory or the modern substitute-material?
This was also an interesting point in chapter 10 for me: the reflection on the advantages respective disadvantages of the old ivory-keys and the modern polymer-based replacements. My former Kawai-grand had this replacement and I really can agree of my own experience to what Carhart wrote: "Many pianists, particular concert-pianists, prefer ivory, because it is said to absorb sweat from the fingers and to have a "softer" feel than the polymer-based replacements."
To play on the synthetic substitute felt always a bit slippery, especially if you had washed your hands shortly before playing or if your fingers were perspiring.

In the end of our discussion of chapter 10 I´d like to add, that the title of this chapter "The world bcomes louder" is a very true description of the development of keyboard-instruments.
If we think of the silent intimacy of a clavichord (I recently have listened to a recording of Bachs prelude in b-flat-major of WTCI played on a clavichord, it was so fascinating and beautiful) and compare it with the loud and full tone of a modern Steinway, then it´s clear, that even a tone played piano on the Steinway corresponds nearly to a tone played forte on a clavichord.

O.k., now I´ll go to the "Lessons". :wink:

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Andreas - I got your present. :wink: Did you get mine?

Book time:

Quote:
. I found to be interesting the comparison to what a man of the middelage must have been felt, when he saw Notre-Dame in Paris, that´s what must have felt a musician of the 19th century when sitting on Beethovens "Graf"-grand.

Yes – I thought that was a good analogy as well.

Quote:
I could imagine, there is a reson, why the keys are black and white. Since the keys were made of ivory until 1980, they are white of their nature and I suppose, the best colour to make them different from these white ivory-keys was black for the chromatic tones. That´s my personal explanation, what do you think?


Technically, any two colors would work. I once saw a Steinway concert grand where the black keys were yellow, and the white keys were green. Or maybe it’s orange and purple – now I can’t remember.

My grand has the modern substitute. I wish I had the ivory keys. My keys can get pretty slippery sometimes. But then I do what Rubinstein did – spray hairspray on them to make them sticky.

Quote:
If we think of the silent intimacy of a clavichord (I recently have listened to a recording of Bachs prelude in b-flat-major of WTCI played on a clavichord, it was so fascinating and beautiful) and compare it with the loud and full tone of a modern Steinway, than it´s clear, that even a tone played piano on the Steinway corresponds nearly to a tone played forte on a clavichord.


I was at a luncheon not long ago and our guest speaker was a man who builds clavichords. He gave us a concert on his clavichord and it was very hard to hear. Everybody in the room had to sit very still.

Andreas - I read the next two chapters, but I'm too tired to write anything about them now. I promise to do it in the morning.

Nighty-night

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Pianolady wrote:
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Andreas - I got your present. :wink: Did you get mine?


No, not yet, but I received an e-mail, which seemed to be uncomplete, it stoped in a setence and had no attachment. BTW, I have another nice present for you. But you have to wait a little bit. :wink:

Quote:
I could imagine, there is a reson, why the keys are black and white. Since the keys were made of ivory until 1980, they are white of their nature and I suppose, the best colour to make them different from these white ivory-keys was black for the chromatic tones. That´s my personal explanation, what do you think?


Quote:
My grand has the modern substitute. I wish I had the ivory keys. My keys can get pretty slippery sometimes. But then I do what Rubinstein did – spray hairspray on them to make them sticky.


Oh, that´s interesting, I didn´t know that. I´d test it, if I still would have my old Kawai. (I think, I wouldn´t like the smell while playing.)

Quote:
I was at a luncheon not long ago and our guest speaker was a man who builds clavichords. He gave us a concert on his clavichord and it was very hard to hear. Everybody in the room had to sit very still.


Wow, that´s interesting. I´d like to hear also a clavichord live.

Quote:
Andreas - I read the next two chapters, but I'm too tired to write anything about them now. I promise to do it in the morning.


I´ve not read chapter 11 until now, because yesterday I have recorded two Chopin-pieces and I had severe problems with my video-program (I sat on it until 3 o´clock in the morning, then I fall into my bed. :roll: )
On monday school begins again, then I´ll see, how it goes with reading further. May be this night I´ll read chapter 11, if I find the time.

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Nighty-night

That sounds funnily, translated into German it´s like a word-play "nächtliche Nacht", I suppose.

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musicusblau wrote:
That sounds funnily, translated into German it´s like a word-play "nächtliche Nacht", I suppose.


Try to say that fast 3 times! :lol:

Ok, our character is taking lessons now. Great! Sounds like he likes Anna a lot. Some of the things she is making him do are interesting, although I don't think I would like doing them that much. I'm sure it helps when you need to memorize a piece, though.

And then chapter 11 - I like this part - all these different and interesting people gathering at the atelier. I don't quite understand what Luc said about the Freemasons. It seems he does not agree with their philosophies. Mozart was a Freemason - so was my grandfather.

ok - that's it for now.

I re-sent that 'present' a few moments ago.

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Pianolady wrote:
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Try to say that fast 3 times! :lol:


Indeed, that´s not too easy. :lol:

Quote:
Mozart was a Freemason - so was my grandfather.


That´s very interesting. I have read a book and visited a symposium about MOzarts "Zauberflöte" (Magic flute) as a Freemason-opera. This theme is absolutely fascinating for me, because I personally for me am on a similar way. I´ll read chapter 11 tonight.

Quote:
I re-sent that 'present' a few moments ago.


Thank you so much Monica. I have received your complete mail now and I´ll write a reply soon. :D

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PIanolady wrote:
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Ok, our character is taking lessons now. Great! Sounds like he likes Anna a lot. Some of the things she is making him do are interesting, although I don't think I would like doing them that much. I'm sure it helps when you need to memorize a piece, though.


Hurray, I´ve read chapter 11, too. I have done all these things very much, too, like Thad, and I think, they help very much to understand music deeply and profoundly, you are a complete other interpret, if you understand a piece in its structure. For me this is immensely important and part of my musical base and philosophy, may be I´m a bit like Anna in this point.
But I don´t like too much the literary recommendation, Anna gives to Thad. The book "Zen und die Kunst des Bogenschießens" is by Eugene Herrigel, which was a famous professor of philosophy and later in the time between 1933-45 he joined the NSDAP under Adolf Hitler and advanced to the director of the University of Erlangen. He always was an enthused adherer of the japanese and zen-budhism, but in the 1930th he worked on the communities between the NS-ideology (like fidelity to fatherland, to die for the fatherland etc.) and the zen-philosophy. This book (Zen und die Kunst des Bogenschießens) was adjusted in the 1950th from its racial ideals and was first translated into English and Japanese. It´s the only work of Eugene Herrigel, people are speaking about today.

Quote:
And then chapter 11 - I like this part - all these different and interesting people gathering at the atelier. I don't quite understand what Luc said about the Freemasons. It seems he does not agree with their philosophies. Mozart was a Freemason - so was my grandfather.


Are you sure, you are talking about chapter 11? I didn´t find something about the Freemasons here. Probably you mean chapter 12. Tomorrow I´ll make my visite to "Café Atelier". :wink:

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musicusblau wrote:
But I don´t like too much the literary recommendation, Anna gives to Thad. The book "Zen und die Kunst des Bogenschießens" is by Eugene Herrigel, which was a famous professor of philosophy and later in the time between 1933-45 he joined the NSDAP under Adolf Hitler and advanced to the director of the University of Erlangen. He always was an enthused adherer of the japanese and zen-budhism, but in the 1930th he worked on the communities between the NS-ideology (like fidelity to fatherland, to die for the fatherland etc.) and the zen-philosophy. This book (Zen und die Kunst des Bogenschießens) was adjusted in the 1950th from its racial ideals and was first translated into English and Japanese. It´s the only work of Eugene Herrigel, people are speaking about today.



Very interesting. I didn't know anything about this.


musicusblau wrote:
Are you sure, you are talking about chapter 11? I didn´t find something about the Freemasons here. Probably you mean chapter 12. Tomorrow I´ll make my visite to "Café Atelier". :wink:


Oops, sorry – yes, the Freemason part is in Chapter 12. And Andreas – are you going to become a Freemason? I don’t’ think they take women, do they? For a long time I have wanted very much to find out what my Grandfather was up to when he was one.


Unrelated to this, but related to pianos - I was doing some other reading about pianos today and learned that Grotrian has a duo grand piano – two grand pianos placed side by side with keyboards at opposite ends, with removable rim parts, connected soundboards, and a common lid. Doesn't that sound interesting? Wonder if there is a photo of it somewhere.

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Pianolady wrote:
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Oops, sorry – yes, the Freemason part is in Chapter 12. And Andreas – are you going to become a Freemason? I don’t’ think they take women, do they? For a long time I have wanted very much to find out what my Grandfather was up to when he was one.


No, don´t worry, Monica, I´m not going to become a freemason and I have to admit, that I don´t know, if they take women. I´m just very interested in the religious symbols of Mozarts opera "The Magic Flute" and I have read the following book:
"Die Zauberflöte" (=The Magic Flute) by Alfons Rosenberg. He lived 1902-1985, at the beginning he was a communists, but then he developed to a philosoph and god-seeker. He wrote some books about symbols and there history. There exists also a famous book about Mozarts "Don Giovanni".
The Freemasons in their origin had a deep human and religious philosophy, but later, they became quite secularised, they were also a community of craftsmen and businessmen and got an important influence on the development of politics. There are theories, that they also are responsible for the French Revolution. And these secularised things are more mentioned in chapter 12, which I have read now, btw.
I´m only interested in their religious and mystic symbols, which are very deep. Mozart was a true adept, so far it is sure for me.

Isn´t it interesting, that Luc buys sitar-strings for his spinets and harpsichords? I found also very interesting this typical french atmosphere of discussion of the several people, who were in Lucs "Cafe Atelier". I can second this by own experience. (I still several times was in France and when I was still a pupil I had a french correspondent in an exchange of students. He visited me in Germany and I did the same and went to France.)

Quote:
Unrelated to this, but related to pianos - I was doing some other reading about pianos today and learned that Grotrian has a duo grand piano – two grand pianos placed side by side with keyboards at opposite ends, with removable rim parts, connected soundboards, and a common lid. Doesn't that sound interesting? Wonder if there is a photo of it somewhere.


Yes, this sounds extremely interesting. I really would like to see a photo of it! Do you know the name of this model?
In the middle of nineteenth century nearly Grotrian and Steinweg separated. Steinweg went to New York, Grotrian continued to build pianos in Braunschweig (Germany). Steinweg changed his name into "Steinway" and his sons took the enterprise and named it "Steinway and sons". But the old Steinweg didn´t stay in New York. In the 1880th he went back to Hamburg (Germany) and built the "Steinways" there. So, there are German and American Steinways now. (My tuner says, that the German Steinways are better than the American ones, because they have another technique.)
Grotrian continued to built his own pianos, and that are the "Grotrian-Steinweg"-pianos of today. (They are not as expensive as Steinways, but expensive enough. F. ex. my model the Concert grand with a length of 2, 26m costs nearly 60000 Euro today, if you buy a new one. I recently saw an actual price-list. So I had a big luck to buy my nearly 25 years old model for 14000 Euro only. I think, I have made a bargain with it. I feel this piano really to be a great treasure, because of it´s high capability to produce shading nuances. This is possible because of its wide measure, my tuner has explained to me.)

Now book-time again:
In chapter 13 I find very suitable and adequate Thad´s thoughts to Beethovens Diabelli-variations. He said, that they are like an abstract of the classical era like Bachs Goldberg-variations are for the baroque epoch.
Here in chapter 13 it becomes clear again, that Thad likes the spontanous and private sphere of music-making respective piano-playing. So, he is deeply moved by listening to several musicians, which he heard either by passing through the streets of Paris or through open windows on the courtyard, f.ex. the older lady playing Beethovens Diabelli-variations, the jazz-guitarist, harpenist, flutist and the accompanist, who has several singers in his appartment.
He visits Jean Paul, the accompanist, and has an interesting discussion about perfect pitch and relative pitch and about song against piano, which is considered as a percussion-instrument by Jean-Paul.
Jean-Paul tells us about the advatanges and disadvantages of perfect pitch (I think, in German it´s "absolutes Gehör", "absolute ear"). The problem is, that his pitch is trained on the usual a=440 Hz, and if an instrument is tuned a bit higher he gets big problems. He also said, that a piano can never made to be singing like a real voice, even most pianists want to make the piano sing.
He describes the qualities of an accompanist: tact, humility, kindness and firmness about musical principles. I personally second that.
Very interesting for me is, that Farinelli as an exemplar of the old singers, had much knowledge in musical harmony and theory. I think, this is very important not only for the instrumentalists, but also for the singers. So, I agree to Jean-Pauls attitude at hundert percent again.
And I really didn´t know, that Swjatoslaw Richter worked in Odessa as an accompanist in clubs and for light entertainment in his early years, and that he got the knowledge, that "some things come only out, if you are forced to join the discontinuous notes of a piano to the ceaseless stream of the voice". Accompaning means for Jean Paul to breath together "and the music is your breath".

Truely, chapter 13 is a very profound one. I like it very much.

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pianolady wrote:
I was doing some other reading about pianos today and learned that Grotrian has a duo grand piano – two grand pianos placed side by side with keyboards at opposite ends, with removable rim parts, connected soundboards, and a common lid. Doesn't that sound interesting? Wonder if there is a photo of it somewhere.


I found a photo of this intriguing piano on the internet - I think its peculiarities show fairly well in this picture. I also remember reading that another piano company has come out with a duo-piano just very recently - maybe it was Fazoli? Can't remember. Enjoy!

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Thanks for searching that out for us, Sarah. It looks to be the exact piano I was talking about.

musicusblau wrote:
I´m only interested in their religious and mystic symbols, which are very deep. Mozart was a true adept, so far it is sure for me.


I like learning about religious and mystical symbols, as well. I also like trying to break secret codes, or overcoming obstacle-like courses.

Quote:
. (My tuner says, that the German Steinways are better than the American ones, because they have another technique.)


I think he says that because he is German! :wink: In reality, both American and German Steinways are equal in quality. The difference lies in their sound – Hamburg Steinway’s hammers are a little harder than American Steinways and so the sound is slightly different. And you can’t argue the fact that professional performers choose between the two pianos equal number of times, some even going as far as using both when they are offered. Here in Chicago at our Orchestral Hall where the Chicago Symphony Orchestra performs, pianists are offered a Hamburg Steinway and an American Steinway, and you see both the same amount of times.



Book time:


Quote:
In chapter 13 I find very suitable and adequate Thad´s thoughts to Beethovens Diabelli-variations. He said, that they are like an abstract of the classical era like Bachs Goldberg-variations are for the baroque epoch.

I’ve never taken the time to learn about the Diabelli variations. I will do that someday.

Quote:
He visits Jean Paul, the accompanist, and has an interesting discussion about perfect pitch and relative pitch and about song against piano, which is considered as a percussion-instrument by Jean-Paul

I thought everybody considered the piano to be a percussion instrument, didn’t you? And yes – don’t we talk about our attempts to make the melody line sing on our pianos. I think this is somewhat possible with good legato, although of course we cannot make the volume of the tone change once we have struck the key. But singers can’t make their voices sing a chord, either, so we all have our limitations.

I enjoyed this chapter too - mostly because I like how Thad was so interested in hearing how all his other neighbors are busy practicing their instruments too.

And Andreas - I know you are back to work this week, so don't worry if it takes you some time to do the reading and commenting.

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Sarah wrote:
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I found a photo of this intriguing piano on the internet - I think its peculiarities show fairly well in this picture. I also remember reading that another piano company has come out with a duo-piano just very recently - maybe it was Fazoli? Can't remember. Enjoy!


Wow, that´s very interesting and amazing, Sarah! Thank you so much for to have posted it here! :D

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You're welcome! :D

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Pianolady wrote:
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I like learning about religious and mystical symbols, as well. I also like trying to break secret codes, or overcoming obstacle-like courses.


May be there exists a translation into English of the book of Alfons Rosenberg?

Quote:
I think he says that because he is German! :wink: In reality, both American and German Steinways are equal in quality. The difference lies in their sound – Hamburg Steinway’s hammers are a little harder than American Steinways and so the sound is slightly different. And you can’t argue the fact that professional performers choose between the two pianos equal number of times, some even going as far as using both when they are offered. Here in Chicago at our Orchestral Hall where the Chicago Symphony Orchestra performs, pianists are offered a Hamburg Steinway and an American Steinway, and you see both the same amount of times.


I think, you are absolutely right with that. I personally like the softer Steinways more than the harder ones, so, I suppose, I would prefer an American Steinway.

Quote:
I thought everybody considered the piano to be a percussion instrument, didn’t you? And yes – don’t we talk about our attempts to make the melody line sing on our pianos. I think this is somewhat possible with good legato, although of course we cannot make the volume of the tone change once we have struck the key. But singers can’t make their voices sing a chord, either, so we all have our limitations.


I agree at hundert percent.

Quote:
And Andreas - I know you are back to work this week, so don't worry if it takes you some time to do the reading and commenting.


O.k., thank you, Monica. In every case I want to read further, because I find this book to be very interesting and it´s a personal enrichment for me to improve my English with it. I truely still feel much surer with it now.
This evening f.ex. I´ll still find some time, I think, and I like to read also in the evening instead of to watch TV or so. Í´ll see, what I can do. So, if you´ll have a look into this thread from time to time, you´ll see, if I could proceed or not.

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O.k., a short book time before I go to bed now:
I ´ve read chapter 14. Very interesting, what Luc said about the tempered and equal tuning. I knew all that and that Bach wasn´t the first, who has written for the well-tempered clavier, before him - and this is not mentioned in the novel - there was Johann Caspar Ferdinand Fischer, who wrote 22 preludes and fugues for a tempered organ respective piano. He called it "Ariadne Musica". So, Bach was the first, who wrote in all 24 keys.
Very interesting, that Thad says, a tuner has to be a tuner, an artist and a psychologist. I think, that has much truth, because the tuner shouldn´t tune mechanically, but care for special conditions and for what his client prefers.
Really new for me was this theme of inscriptions of invisible parts of the piano. Very interesting. And I was moved by the story of a Steinway-master, who found the name of his late father in a grand-piano, he had to repair.
Does your piano have any invisible inscriptions? I´ll look, if my one has some...

Image

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Good morning, Andreas! :wink:

Just a quick note to tell you that I have not had the time to read Chapter 14 yet. I can probably read it later today or tonight, but you may not see any comment from me until late today or early tomorrow.

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Pianolady wrote:
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I can probably read it later today or tonight, but you may not see any comment from me until late today or early tomorrow.


Don´t mention. We are not in any hurry. :wink:

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OMG!!!! :shock: I leave for a week and half camping trip with the monsters and you're almost done already!!!! hehehehe

I checked at local library and that's a no-go ... so I'm gonna go order from Amazon upon finishing this post. thank goodness ya'll are reading slowly! :)

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OK, book is ordered and will be here mañana! yippee!!!

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Wow, that's fast, Nathan! Read up to chapter 14 as fast as you can. You will be happy to know that they are short chapters.

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Wow, that´s great, Nathan, that we get a third reader. It´s a nice book.

Today my order arrived and I have received the normal book of our novel from the bookshop I have ordered it first, but they have said to me, that there are problems of delivery. Until now I have only read in my e-book-version on my computer. Although I had annuled this order (,because I had bought it already as an e-book), they send it to me, strange isn´t it?
Now my wife said, that she wants to read it eventually, too. So, I didn´t send back the consignment I received, but I think, I´ll keep it.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 12:57 pm 
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Ok, I have read chapter 14. I think it was interesting learning about piano tuners. And also the fact that the ear should be trained to listen to piano strings early - like before a person turns 25 years old. Guess it is too late for me then!

I have watched my tuner tune my piano many times. He uses a laptop computer but also sometimes uses only his ear. It amazes me how he can hear the slightest of pitch changes.

And I also think it is neat for a piano craftsman to sign his name in some hidden place inside the piano. I would if it were me. In fact, I have signed my name all over my house - inside walls, under stairs, etc. We did some major home improvements when we first moved into the house I live in now. Build new walls, took out flooring, things like that. Whenever we built new walls, my husband and I, even our kids sometimes, signed our names before the new drywall (sheet rock) (plaster board)(there are several names for this material)went up.

My tuner has also signed and dated his name inside my piano. Just on one of the keys. I bought my piano new, and the first time he tuned it is when he did that. It is to make a reference for anyone to know a little bit as to the date of my piano. Whether there any other names inside my piano, I do not know.

Ok, on to chapter 15. Remember - no need to rush. Plus, it will give Nathan time to catch up.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 8:03 pm 
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Oh, Andreas - I'm just sneaking in here for a moment to tell you something. I'm reading chapter 15 right now, and found something in it that you will like! :)

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 9:31 pm 
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Hi Monica,
I was really to curious to read on, so that I have finished chapter 15. (Sorry, Nathan, but you can write something also to the previous chapters and we could discuss it, if you like, this would be very nice anyway.)

Thank you for your nice advice, Monica. I can imagine, what you mean. :) There is mentioned an old Grotrian-Steinweg-grand from the 20th, which was restored for an old lady. :wink:
In this chapter I find interesting Luc´s behaviour to people, who have to sell their pianos, but are not in fact ready to separate from them. He is full of respect and comprehension. I think, his idea, that the people should burn their old pianos, if they aren´t to repair and to use anymore and to cook their sausages on them, is a good one. So, they could process their close to a certain part of their lifes better, I suppose, as if they just give it away and always remember it and suffer from this. What do you think?

I think, Carhart does narrate in a sensitive and descriptive manner of singular fates related to pianos. This is very interesting and increases the pleasure to read this subtle work of literature.

I really ask me, if pianos in our times of today still have so much meaning to so many people like it is described in the book. (Though it´s written in 2000, isn´t it?) I´m sure, there still exists men, who feel so and who can find themselves in the novel of Carhart, but the number of them probably decreases, I suppose. Do you agree?

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 9:51 pm 
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So, book is in ... I just read first chapter and had to come comment. first of all, yummy yummy writing, no? "voluptuous fantasy" .... wow

In any case, I'm too poor to be reading this book ... I can already tell it's gonna wake up buried desires that I've long been repressing ... hence, ya'll will have to listen to me whine about my pitiable POS baldwin upright. My wife would have an attack if I tried to get a real piano. *sigh*

Ok, gonna go get the kids and will catch up to ya'll this evening.

PS-- my book has an afterword with notes for a book club. how funny is that??

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:09 pm 
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I'm supposed to be working right now, but I'm not. haha

I'll write notes on chapter 15 later. Nathan - yes, go ahead and post any thoughts you have on the earlier chapters.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:08 am 
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ok, brief post before supper .... I just finished ch9.

When he brought home his piano, I actually got a little turned on ... I love his description of those first moments .... reminded me of my first time with the missus. Quite sweet actually.

And I do that thing too with pianos ... I have to touch and open them, wherever I am ... wholly inappropriate if completely voyeuristic. It was also humbling to realize how little I really know about the workings of the instrument. Of course, i've never been with a piano I love so much. I'm sure that would make a difference.

What was your first public performance like? I really had trouble identifying with his terrifying experience ... I remember my first recital and I loved it (being the quiet and introvert type that you all know me to be). And I always played for guests at house constantly. Only recently do I not perform for others ... unless you count the competing with spongebob for the kid's attention! heh

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 1:25 am 
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Good – you are catching up fast, Nathan.

I never lift the lid of pianos I see in different places and play them. I’m too chicken. Although a couple years ago I was in Liberace’s museum and took a picture of one of his pianos with my cell phone camera. I had to sneak it!

I can very much relate to our character's terrifying experience at his recital. I get that way now! Nerves didn’t bother me as much when I was younger. Don’t remember my first recitals, but I do remember the one when I was 12 and played a Chopin Waltz. It was my first Chopin piece and I felt like a grown-up playing it.

But I absolutely hated playing for people when they came to our home. When I was very young, like between 5 and 13, every time my parent’s friends came over, they always said, “Let’s hear little Monica play something.” I was extremely shy back then and would try to run and hide. There was one solution to the problem, though: We had a grand piano in the living room and an upright piano downstairs, so to help alleviate my fear, I was allowed to go downstairs and play that piano, while everyone else stayed upstairs and listened.

How about you, Andreas – what was your first public performing experience like?



more book time – regarding chapter 14 – burning an old piano and cooking your sausage over the fire. Well, I have never done that! Actually, I’ve never seen a piano being burned. I think that would make me cry a little.

I dunno – I think people today still get hooked on their pianos. It might be that I am too biased, though. I get hooked on anything that I happen to like and then I don’t want to part with it. Others may not feel as sentimental about objects. Not really sure what I think about this one….

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 3:01 pm 
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that imagery of burning a piano was a bit shocking and sacreligious at first ... but now I think maybe it'd be cathartic. Kindof like a wake for an beloved family member I guess.

I don't think sausages though ... smores maybe??

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 4:12 pm 
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I love smores!

Nathan, looks like you have definitely caught up!

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 5:12 pm 
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Pianolady wrote:
Quote:
How about you, Andreas – what was your first public performing experience like?


My first performing experience was, when I played guitar before my class in elementary school. I was seven years old. I think, I have played some melodies of well-known songs and little pieces of my guitar-school (Dieter Kreidler, Gitarrenschule, Band 1).
I have enjoyed it and got much applause!

BTW, what are "smores"? I couldn´t find the word in the dictionary.

Nathan, wow, I can´t imagine, how someone can read so fastly a book, and even in English :lol: . I have needed two weeks for coming to chapter 15.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:08 pm 
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This is how you make a smore:

1. build a fire

2. find a long stick

3. Stick a marshmallow on the end of the stick and then stick it in the fire. :lol:

4. The marshmallow may catch on fire, but that's ok - just blow it out.

5. Then take a graham cracker and break it into two equal pieces (squares).

6. Take half of a Hershey chocolate bar and but it on one of the graham cracker squares.

7. Then put the hot marshmallow on top of the chocolate and put the other graham cracker square on top of that.

8. What you get is like a sandwich - graham cracker, chocolate bar and marshmallow. Because the marshmallow is hot, it starts to melt the chocolate and the whole thing gets a little gooey. It's messy to eat, but it sure is super yummy!

Ok, I'm reading chapter 16 now.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:10 pm 
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Thanks, Monica. Sounds really tasty.
First I´ll play a bit Chopin, thenI´ll read chapter 16.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 8:17 pm 
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Ok, I just finished ch. 16.

I like that music school that Thad found for his children. And isn't it neat that Debussy and Albeniz (others as well) also studied there? I am hoping to go to Paris in a couple years. If I do, I will try to find this building. I'm also going to visit every place where Chopin visited and lived. Maybe if I am lucky, his ghost will pay me a visit me too. :D

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2009 9:21 pm 
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Phew, I have finished chapter 16. :D
Yes, it´s really a school full of history and atmosphere, I think. I like Thads idea, to look for a piano-teacher for his daughter, which will motivate her and not to teach her "solfège". This kind of theory has made me dislike music, too, when I was a child. I still could play the guitar, which I learned in private lessons, and sight-read, when I had to learn "solfège" at the civic music-school, where I first started to learn Cello with 11 years. After a half year I stopped with this (very beautiful and soulful) instrument and changed to piano, because this was my very wish.
It must be a very interesting atmosphere with all the old Erards, Pleyels and Gaveaus on the one side and the more modern instruments on the other there in the Schola Cantorum.
My tuner says, that the individual characters of the piano-brands decrease more and more, because they all try to approach to the Steinway-like piano-building and give up their old manners to built pianos. As an example he mentioned Bechstein. They always said, that their manner is better and that they don´t need steinway-like building-manner, but now they have taken over some techniques of piano-building, which Steinway uses.

All this development is really a pity IMO! Sometimes I wished to have lived in 19th century. :roll: May be we should open a synthesizer-forum to stay up to date and write a book called "The synthesizer-shop on the right bank", isn´t it? Oh my dears, we are on the headed south. :wink: :lol:

Monica, if you´ll meet the ghost of Chopin, tell him, I´ll try my very best to play his third Scherzo and send him my regards! 8) :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 5:58 am 
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I wonder why albeniz is so neglected in comparison with some others??

It must be a joy to be surrounded with so much sound. I find myself quite envious of Thad.

andreas, I read ridiculously fast ... just like I make love! :? I'm trying to rein myself in and go at same pace as you guys ... so I'm reading other books while we do this one together! ... if only I could use my powers for good ....

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:38 pm 
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Albeniz was very good friends with Granados.Image

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