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 Post subject: Fast Octaves
PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2007 6:37 am 
A lot of pieces that i play seem to demand fast octave/large chord playing and i have to admit i am struggling a bit. Has anyone got any hints or tips to help me improve my technique and allow me to play them basically as fast as normal passage work. I'm sure I'm doing something wrong...cheers


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:08 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 4:18 pm
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Location: damwoude
do it very slow and let the key puch your finger up... after a couple of days you can improve your speed and its really important that you don't have any tension in your wrist (I had some troubles with it for 2 months!)

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music is enough for lifetime but lifetime isn't enough for music 'rachmaninoff'

while composing I've got always an picture in my head 'beethoven'


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2007 9:01 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2006 5:29 am
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Location: Germany
If you need to play chromatic octave runs it is perhaps helpful (and sounds better) if you alternate the fingering between pinky and 4th finger, sometimes even with 3rd finger while moving from one octave note to the next. So that you have a leading voice, capable to play legato and fast (because of finger alternating), while the thumb just moves along. For RH and LH it's the same.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2007 8:29 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2007 8:06 pm
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Location: CZ
Hi, octave runs practice with first and fifth ( 4 ) finger separately, then play it commonly with two fingers. Start with few chords and practice it, get it to tempo, think about its like one fluent movement,then add next chord, and next chord ...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2007 9:30 am 
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Location: damwoude
could you explain why with 1 and 4th finger??

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music is enough for lifetime but lifetime isn't enough for music 'rachmaninoff'

while composing I've got always an picture in my head 'beethoven'


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2007 2:26 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:03 pm
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Location: Obamanation, unfortunately...
I think because it gives a chance for the muscles which operate the 5th finger a chance to "rest". Since that your 4th finger is much stronger than the 5th you can go for a lot longer playing octaves with the 1st and 4th.

But the only problem is trying to train yourself playing with the 4th finger. At first it seems uncomfortable and you will sometimes slip and play a 7th instead of an 8th or sometimes you will play two notes with the 4th finger.

I still can't "perfect" that technique. ...someday....just someday :D

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Madam, what makes you think that I play with my hands?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2007 4:16 pm 
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Location: Germany
rachmaninoff wrote:
could you explain why with 1 and 4th finger??


Beside what juufa said, it is so that if you like to play octave runs legato, you have no other choice! You need to take the pinky, ring finger alternating so that at least one note of the both are executed legato. Or even the middle finger too, alternating between pinky + thumb, ring finger + thumb, middle finger + thumb (if the reach is enough for an octave for middle finger + thumb).

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Olaf Schmidt


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:50 am 
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Location: damwoude
I tried to do the 4 but there is so much more tension.... in my hand

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music is enough for lifetime but lifetime isn't enough for music 'rachmaninoff'

while composing I've got always an picture in my head 'beethoven'


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 11:19 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:02 pm
Posts: 201
Location: Germany
rachmaninoff wrote:
I tried to do the 4 but there is so much more tension.... in my hand

Try using the 4th for black keys. This should create much less tension compared to doing all of them with the weak 5th, besides the legato issue MindenBlues stated. At least it does for me, though I'm no virtuoso, you must know.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:56 pm 
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Location: Obamanation, unfortunately...
Oh and another reason why the 4th finger is useful:


Play a F octave with your left hand using the 1st and 5th fingers. Now notice that it will take a couple more milliseconds for you to lift your 5th finger up to the F#. Your 4th finger is at an advantage to play the F# because it is a lot closer to it than the 5th finger.

Hope this made sense.

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Madam, what makes you think that I play with my hands?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:07 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 7:02 pm
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Location: Germany
juufa72 wrote:
Oh and another reason why the 4th finger is useful:


Play a F octave with your left hand using the 1st and 5th fingers. Now notice that it will take a couple more milliseconds for you to lift your 5th finger up to the F#. Your 4th finger is at an advantage to play the F# because it is a lot closer to it than the 5th finger.

Hope this made sense.

Yes, this is what I wanted to say. :wink:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:40 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:03 pm
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Location: Obamanation, unfortunately...
Hot damn this guy is fast:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kv6v8Bo ... ed&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xjiIlc5 ... ed&search=

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Madam, what makes you think that I play with my hands?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 5:15 pm 
juufa72 wrote:

Hot damn this guy is fast:




Wow thats fast! :o He looks like that old superhero The Flash :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: Fast Octaves
PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 3:20 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2007 8:45 am
Posts: 87
Location: New Zealand
Steele wrote:
A lot of pieces that i play seem to demand fast octave/large chord playing and i have to admit i am struggling a bit. Has anyone got any hints or tips to help me improve my technique and allow me to play them basically as fast as normal passage work. I'm sure I'm doing something wrong...cheers


Practice slowly and absolute relaxation on your wrist (actually your whole arm) :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 1:57 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 4:18 pm
Posts: 305
Location: damwoude
I practiced the 4th finger method. you can do it in 30 minutes and then you can speed up. it really works!

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music is enough for lifetime but lifetime isn't enough for music 'rachmaninoff'

while composing I've got always an picture in my head 'beethoven'


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